59 Comments:
a responsible food critic will visit a restaurant several times and try many different things before writing an article. while your average joe (or jane!) may decide not to eat somewhere again after one bad experience, a food critic is supposed to have a little bit broader base of experience with a place so they can report to the average joe/jane about the plusses and minuses.
»» Submitted by just sayin' at 12:55 PM on February 29
I really don't care what food critics have to say, since I don't like a lot of those pretentious, frou-frou dishes anyway.
Give me a burger over shishito peppers and seared tuna any day.
»» Submitted by »»» joanie at 12:57 PM on February 29
Nothing against local axe-grinder Kathie Jenkins personally, but I have never once paid her reviews any mind. I plan to go to P&F as I do all expensive restaurants, that is, for wine and appetizers in the bar.
Theoretically all restaurants should be good (food-wise & service) from the get-go. But in reality, they usually need a few weeks to work out the kinks.
»» Submitted by »»» jane at 1:00 PM on February 29
@jane "I plan to go to P&F as I do all expensive restaurants, that is, for wine and appetizers in the bar. "
That makes two of us.
»» Submitted by »»» JACC at 1:02 PM on February 29
I've never heard of Kathie Jenkins until today. And my first impressions based on this article? She's a hack. I'll make sure to avoid her in the future.
»» Submitted by yoshi at 1:05 PM on February 29
She writes about food for the Pioneer Press...which makes her eminently avoidable.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 1:09 PM on February 29
I think it generally is not a very good idea to do this sort of review, especially of a fine dining restaurant. More moving parts=more to get calibrated.
»» Submitted by Lunch! at 1:17 PM on February 29
I think it's where the print reviewers are trying to catch up with the bloggers. Personally, I believe these first impression pieces are better for a blog, even by a mainstream journo.
g rote: can you tell me what her usual bias is? I have not encountered her before, so I am curious. Is is MPLS or fine dining she dislikes?
»» Submitted by Lunch! at 1:19 PM on February 29
I think it's where the print reviewers are trying to catch up with the bloggers
NEVER!
»» Submitted by »»» JACC at 1:21 PM on February 29
Most people can differentiate between a print reviewer and a blogger. They expect snap opinions from a blog, and polished work from a journalist. Don't get me wrong, I read a ton of blogs, but professional/print media diluting their brand to compete with people who do write for free is insane. You are not competing, you are having a conversation.
»» Submitted by Lunch! at 1:24 PM on February 29
Both Nelson and Jenkins wrote quick reviews. Should they avoid doing so unless they can say something positive? Maybe just indicate the place is open and given an idea of what's on the menu and at what prices?
»» Submitted by »»» Question at 1:27 PM on February 29
Look, I like watching places that deserve it get savaged by reviewers, as much, if not more, than the next guy (it's a product of my Detroit upbringing)
but I say yes...MSM should wait and do multiple visits before printing a review. Bloggers can just spout off after a single visit, aren't held to the same standards and should therefore not be taken as seriously (runs out of room giggling)
The back story is that Kathie Jenkins was called out by Lenny Russo at some point in the past, so she's made it her personal goal to rip his restaurants at every opportunity. If somebody wants to do a deep search on Chowhounds Midwest board, you can probably find the discussion from early last year. Lenny (whom I've never met) went to some length to reveal the entire timeline of the feud...but it may have been scrubbed because of Chowhound's rule against self-referential restauranteur postings.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 1:33 PM on February 29
This city has more food vendettas than a mafia dinner.
»» Submitted by »»» JACC at 1:36 PM on February 29
Or maybe Kathie just had a really crappy meal.
is there a mafia presence in Minnesota? I've always wondered that
»» Submitted by »»» joanie at 1:42 PM on February 29
The Swedish Mafia. They all wear reindeer sweaters and drive saabs.
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 1:42 PM on February 29
There is no mob.
»» Submitted by »»» JACC at 1:46 PM on February 29
Or maybe Kathie just had a really crappy meal.
For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong.
--H. L. Mencken
c'mon Jason...don't you just love a good conspiracy theory?
»» Submitted by »»» g rote at 1:49 PM on February 29
There is no mob.
Okay. I just always thought that since Chicago was so close that maybe some of the mobsters there would've migrated up here at some point. But it's nice that there's no mob presence here.
»» Submitted by »»» joanie at 1:51 PM on February 29
The Minnesota Mafia.
»» Submitted by »»» justpbob at 1:51 PM on February 29
The back story is that Kathie Jenkins was called out by Lenny Russo at some point in the past, so she's made it her personal goal to rip his restaurants at every opportunity. If somebody wants to do a deep search on Chowhounds Midwest board, you can probably find the discussion from early last year. Lenny (whom I've never met) went to some length to reveal the entire timeline of the feud...but it may have been scrubbed because of Chowhound's rule against self-referential restauranteur postings.
Lenny Russo? Did I miss something? Porter & Frye is Stephen Brown's place...
»» Submitted by »»» richg at 2:13 PM on February 29
There was a very heavy mob presence here in the 20's and 30's. It mostly went away after that, though.
»» Submitted by Rez at 2:30 PM on February 29
My wife and I went to a test opening week before last. While there were some kinks we thought the meal was lovely and really enjoyed it. The staff needs a bit more experience, but it was a test evening and we filled out a questionnaire and pointed out our perceived flaws.
Reviewing a restaurant right after it opens is lame and most critics won't do it. A place needs a couple months to hit its stride.
The restaurant looks great.
»» Submitted by Saloth Sar at 3:39 PM on February 29
'Is it a good idea for critics to hold off until the restaurants have hit their stride...or to at least visit on more than one occasion?'
Is it a good idea for a restaurant to hold off charging full price until the restaurant has hit its stride? Or maybe a restaurant should get its act together before it opens.
»» Submitted by »»» fred at 3:51 PM on February 29
I think restaurants try to get everything right before they open. I know P&F did a week of test evenings before they did a soft opening, but nothing can really prepare you for what being fully opened is like. It almost always takes a bit to get things right unless you're some big chain going off of a field manual.
People going to a restaurant right after it opens should expect some hiccups. I'm not saying that that's fair, but it's probably going to happen. If you don't want to pay full price before they iron things out, don't go.
»» Submitted by Saloth Sar at 4:02 PM on February 29
If a restaurant is open for business, then they're open for criticism. If they don't want any criticism, then don't open your doors....
»» Submitted by michael_p at 4:13 PM on February 29
I think critics should be allowed to shit on a platter if they want to.
And then eat it.
Bon Apetit!
I'm pretty sure I don't care what Kathie Jenkins thinks about food, restaurants, or anything for that matter.
Hell with the professional eaters/journalists/hangers on.
If it tastes good, it is good. If you're not fussy, you can eat anything that doesn't crawl off the plate.
I've had fancy meals with boors I had nothing in common with. They make for boring evenings.
Face it, a great meal is one you have with great people.
»» Submitted by The Rat at 7:45 PM on February 29
Amen, Rat. Some of my favorite meals have taken place at Little T's or Perkins at 1 am. Critics be damned!
»» Submitted by »»» aliecat at 12:02 AM on February 29
Ah Little T... I once barfed on the floor waiting for the bathroom there.
Oh wait, this isn't the binge drinking thread.
»» Submitted by »»» mb21 at 12:09 AM on February 29
I have an insane craving for nachos now...dammit!
»» Submitted by »»» aliecat at 12:10 AM on February 29
Back when I reviewed restaurants for the Star Tribune, the policy was to wait at least a month and then visit the place at least twice, before publishing a real review of a new restaurant. But we didn't want to wait that long to get news about new restaurants into the paper, (and get scooped by everybody else in town) so we created the Now Open feature, which is supposed to just provide a quick first look, without attempting to make judgments.
»» Submitted by »»» jiggers at 7:10 AM on March 1
I was at the Home and Garden show with my wife on Friday. We were dressed nicely in our work clothes. She is a realtor and I an attorney.
About 8 o'clock we walked through the skyway back to the Hilton parking ramp, I asked her of she would like dinner at Porter & Frye. She said yes. We went in and they asked if we had a reservation. I said no. They asked if
we would be willing to sit in the bar area, I said no, we would like to sit in the dining room. Maitre d had a brief conference with a server. The server said follow me with no further explanation and she seated us in the bar area.
I was a little perplexed. I went down the stairs and looked in the lower dining room and there were several (7 or 8) tables open. I went back to the front desk and asked why we couldn't go to the lower dining room and why they seated us in the bar area after I said no to sitting in the bar area, where it was noisy. They simply said, I had no reservation.
It was no about 7:30 and our only alternative was the Hilton which I was not that keen about. So we ordered from the restaurant menu but ate in the bar area. The service was slow and the Artic Char I had was cold and undercooked. My wife's walleye was good but not exceptional.
At the end I visited downstairs (about 8:30) and the tables that I saw empty an hour ago were still empty.
The bottom line is I will not be back. The food is not good enough to be a draw and the staff is not sufficiently trained. There are other places downtown that are worth the extra few blocks walk, i.e. the Chambers.
»» Submitted by Okayak at 2:14 PM on March 1
The server said follow me with no further explanation and she seated us in the bar area.
that would have been my cue to exit. no matter how good the place is, your visit is already ruined.
»» Submitted by cubbie at 2:29 PM on March 1
The server said follow me with no further explanation and she seated us in the bar area.
that would have been my cue to exit. no matter how good the place is, your visit is already ruined.
»» Submitted by cubbie at 2:50 PM on March 1
So after you refused to sit in the bar, they still seated you there?
Wow.
Well, looks like this place will be open and shut
»» Submitted by cdiggity at 3:23 PM on March 1
The server said follow me with no further explanation and she seated us in the bar area.
Shouldn't you have said "Objection! Leading the witness." ?
I try not to be too critical or favorable when it comes to new restaurants.
When some restaurants first open they beef up staff to impress and then things change after a few months.
Other new restaurants just have some bad luck while they're working out the kinks.
»» Submitted by »»» JACC at 11:31 AM on March 2
P & F serves great food already, even in their infancy. Check out my blog tomorrow for more on that front, but the idea that really kills me is the one that Fred and subsequent posters raise. I think that all restaurants should be ready 100% when they open, but very few can afford to do the work needed to get there. And I think diners need to remember that when they eat out. Broadway shows do months of performances out of town before they debut in NYC. Restaurants cant. Also Rick's preview was just that, a preview and is simply an opening notice, not a review. Kathy Jenkins can say what she likes, but who cares....really.
I do wonder if restaurants should automatically discount prices by 20% in the first month they're open, while they work out kinks. Don't promote it, just have the manager come over to every table with the bill, thank the customer for trying them out so early, give 20% off, and invite the customer to come back in a couple weeks and try them again.
I would certainly come back. Even if the magic number is 15% or 10%; I think the gesture would go a long way.
Having stated my aversion to newbie restaurants, we went to P&F last night in spite of my better judgement. I'll avoid a full review, but I will say that the service was extremely attentive if not fully polished in the fine-dining sense. A for effort. The food was superb. The lamb porterhouse was the best lamb dish I've ever had anywhere, the salads were spectacularly presented, and the desserts were insane...insane. Particularly the deconstructed apple pie with cheddar cheese ice cream. New rule of thumb...if you're going to a brand new restaurant, pick a quiet night...like a Sunday in March.
»» Submitted by grote at 9:46 AM on March 3
Zimmern's story.
Yes. I'm glad Zimmern's blog brings to light the genius of Stephen Brown. Though I have not yet tried the new place his culinary skills have never ceased to amaze me. Perhaps, his rootlessness in this city's restaurant scene is more a commentary on the lack of a discerning palate among the monied masses rather than his abilities as a chef.
»» Submitted by »»» mikalrev at 1:41 PM on March 3
Lenny Russo's full disclosure of why Kathie Jenkins should not be a food critic is now on Zimmern's blog. Brutal truth, great read.
The Minneapolis Food Wars have really heated up in the last 9 months:
Russo v. Jenkins
Olmer v. Zimmern
Fhima v. the truth
mystery attackers v. Pham
Pham v. Transsexual dine and ditchers
the drama is so thick you could cut it with a broken Riedel wine glass.
»» Submitted by grote at 3:25 PM on March 5
Iggers on P&F in The Rake, with the gratuitous (misspelled) MNSpeak reference.
»» Submitted by grote at 2:08 PM on March 10
Oh, that Iggggers!
Iggers, please!
»» Submitted by grote at 2:15 PM on March 10
Wait...Lamb Porterhouse! Fuck man, I already ate tonight. Lame.
»» Submitted by David Foureyes at 9:22 PM on March 19
Cathy Jenkins was right.
I traveled all the way from new york
to eat a bland, yet pretty greek salad, over cooked dry char, some kind of white sphere dessert, which tasted of baking soda.
With all these big names working in one house, you would think they know how to cook.
They make pretty plates, but taste does matter folks!
To spend 400 dollars on a dinner for two, and still be hungry.
Seems to me this is nothing but glorified TGIfriday fare at ridiculous prices.
»» Submitted by Donkey kong at 9:44 PM on March 24
Did anyone make it to the Sample Circuit event at P&F last night? What a disaster.
»» Submitted by ate76 at 10:34 AM on March 27
I second the comment about the disaster of an event at P&F hosted by Sample Circuit. Clearly in my mind it was P&F that screwed up - - - where was the food? There were more than enough servers, but either there were no cooks in the kitchen, or no food for them to cook. Then to see Steven Brown walking around the event - - - HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE KITCHEN! So unfortunately I'm on Jenkin's side this time. I love reading Zimmern's stuff, but he obviously gets better treatment in town than the rest of us - I guess that's no surprise.
»» Submitted by badger at 1:42 PM on March 28
I third it.
I have given this place three chances, they have failed miserably in service, food quality, and the 45 minutes it takes to get a beer.
»» Submitted by donkey kong at 1:05 PM on March 29
I'll fourth it. What a complete disaster.
I'm no fan of Kathie, but I think she's onto something here. I really expected more from Chef Brown. He's got the chops, but you wouldn't have known it Wednesday night.
»» Submitted by melbellr at 10:55 AM on March 30
Too bad for those that had a bad experience at P&F, because my friends and I were treated like royalty this past Friday night (3/28). We had the best service I have ever had in MN (felt like NYC polish) and exceptional food. We had a wonderful experience all around. Porter and Frye is my new favorite restaurant. Try the Swordfish. It was exceptional. The cocktails are fabulous, too. The Frenchie is Yummy! I think that they are doing limited seating right now because I got the runaround on an 8pm reservation (had to book at 8:30) and there were plenty of open tables when we arrived at 8 for a cocktail in the bar. So just because the restaurant isn't packed, they might be limiting the seating until they have enough polished staff and know things will run smoothly at full capacity. I say give it another go!
»» Submitted by katy at 2:37 PM on March 31
I also had a wonderful experience at P & F, which I wrote about in the comments here.
Went there last Saturday and the food and service was not worth it. Waited over an hour and a half for our dinners. Should have went somewhere else. It is still a disaster.
»» Submitted by srsmda at 8:28 AM on May 15
Went there last saturday and it took over an hour and a half to get our dinners and the lobster was undercooked. Don't waste you time and money there.
»» Submitted by ananymous at 8:06 AM on May 19
Try having breakfast or lunch on Saturday and Sunday if you want to be real disappointed. It appears that Mr. Brown and his FOH management staff take weekends off.
»» Submitted by Mauritius at 1:17 PM on May 27
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